Ervin Somogyi DVD - Voicing the Guitar - review?

[Daniel P]

Have any of you viewed Ervin Somogyi's dvd Voicing the Guitar?

I see that its sold out on his website, but wonder if its worth tracking down a used copy? I know some are skeptical of his more subjective approach to building, but I've found many of his online article very interesting.

Is it a good source of inspiration or information?

[ken cierp]

He is an interesting guy and I value his opinions -- but to "me" ---- seems some of his math, physics, and dare I say "logical" conclusions are pulled out of thin air by first setting up a "straw man" scenario. I am just going by what I have gleaned off the internet, I don't own any of his publications. And he does ask and I guess gets $10,000 plus for one of his guitars, so who am I to judge? I see the DVD new is $50.

[John Link]

Ervin has posted new prices, effective Jun 1, 2014.

$34,000 (Hello Dave B ...) plus tax and shipping. For that you get:

Any model he makes.

Legal Brazilian rosewood B&S with provenance, or any other wood you want + any wood you want for the soundboard.

6 or 12 strings; cutaway (deduct $400 if you don't want it), custom neck specs; bound fingerboard with abalone position markers; Schaller, Gotoh, or Van Gent tuners; near custom rosette; wood bindings; clear pickguard if you want; French Polish finish; Calton case; lifetime warranty.

Current wait time is 1 to 1.5 years.

[John Link]

I have the DVD in question. For me, the best part of it is when he displays, front and back, several tops in the process of voicing. He taps each one while it is clamped in a mold that simulates its being glued to sides without a back. This yields a good idea of the sound he seeks in the raw top.

The final top, which he says is finished, yields a tone I had never heard before - very deep, the relaxed frog sound I think I can hear in his finished guitars.

The audience asks that he turn that one around too. He refuses. I think it is safe to suppose that the removal process seen in the previous tops has simply been continued further and that, therefore, you don't really need to see the backside. In a blog, he apologized for the refusal.

His theories mostly seem like common sense, though he ignores the existence of a tri-pole which many, including Brian Burns, say is an empirical fact.

If I were buying just one thing of Ervin's for my library, it would be the DVD. The sound of his finished top says more than all the writing combined, if you are interested in the sound he gets.

Amazon for the DVD:

http://www.amazon.com/Voicing-Guitar-Er ... in+somogyi

[ken cierp]

OK, perhaps a little cynical -- here's the challenge (and I have tried) find and post a sound clip of a Somogyi guitar that demonstrates why anyone would purchase one of these $32000! instruments because of its acoustic musical superiority. Having played and been disappointed with instruments from Charles Fox and Cumpiano (Bill's are rather reasonably priced) I sometimes think guitar lovers miss the point by getting drawn in and over whelmed by the hype.

[John Link]

Interesting Ken. I don't think such a demonstration can be found. At best, aesthetics have just a rough correlation to pricing. And then, the aesthetics of sound are quite different than those of appearance ... the guitar as "ornament" often correlates much better to price than the guitar as musical instrument. For instance, regarding the $60k Martin current copy of its own pre-war D-45, would any sound clip demonstrate why it carries the price it does? Comparing a picture of it to one of the $114k dreads covered with shell at least tends to explain the difference in price between the two models.

Regarding Somogyi's new instruments, his 1 year wait list, in combination of his price schedule, explains a lot about why things are as they are. I imagine Martin has a similar sales record for its $60k D-45 and the $114k model. When enough people consistently pay a certain price for a product, that is pretty much what one has to pay if you want your own instance. If we could charge $30k and still maintain a 1 year wait list, I think most of us could accommodate such a circumstance.

On the other end of the scale, I have a 1920 Oscar Schmidt I paid just a little over $100 for that has a very large sound. I think a clip of it, played by someone good (that's not me), would make its price seem strange too.

Ervin himself goes into why anyone would buy an "expensive guitar" (and other issues of value) here:

http://www.esomogyi.com/blog.html#candid

He calls it the "Dance Of The Purchase-And-Sale". The phrase seems pejorative, but he examines it from a broader perspective than that.

Pricing, especially the apparent dominance of the factory guitar over the luthier built instrument, is fascinating. Not all of it is in the ear, eye, and mind of the beholder, but a lot of it is.

[ken cierp]

I really like that pricing article --- for me it goes to show if the "seller" cannot quantify the value of the object --- "buyer beware." Shopping with one's heart rather than one's head usually ends up in a loosing proposition. Paying collector's value for a new -- anything (remember Beany Babies) , makes no sense to me. $32000 kind of gives a peek at the Somogyi ego.