Acoustic Guitar Construction in the small shop -- Kenneth Michael Guitars LLC

Information, ideas and help for those constructing scratch built acoustic guitars or acoustic guitar kits - © 2017
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The purpose of this forum site is to provide a means for acoustic guitar makers at all skill levels to forward information, share experience and ask questions if project obstacles are encountered. We ask that egos be left at the door – the highest levels of courtesy and respect are to be shown to all. Posts containing disparaging comments will be removed. The “Acoustic Guitar Construction Forum” is owned by Kenneth Michael Guitars and is copy protected. Direct links to luthier suppliers are not permitted and will be edited.



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 Post subject: 12 string bridge layout
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:08 pm 
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Location: Granby, CT
Been thinking of making a 12-string bridge for myself, before I forget how to use the tooling I made up to orient and cut the saddle slot...

Not finding much information I could use, so I'm asking the group where I can find the string layout parameters, like spacing from low E to high E, how the octave strings are oriented with their 'regular' paired string, distance the octave strings are set back (ahead?) of the 'normal' strings, and how far strings are separated within pairs. And is a belly bridge stretched front to back to accommodate the second row of pins, maybe the distance between the rows?

Besides what I'm asking about, I think I've got this project figured out.

Thanks very much.

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Peter Havriluk


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 12:05 pm 
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Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Don Teeter describes an effective way to determine saddle layout for 12-strings in his repair books. If you follow it, you will get good compensation for both the heavy and light strings that form each pair.

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John

http://brokenheartguitars.com


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 2:15 pm 
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Peter, I would make my saddle on the thick side. That way you have the space for intonation on each string.
ood luck
Herman


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 4:33 pm 
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Thanks, folks.

I agree about saddle thickness. I used 1/8" for saddle thickness on the 2 six-string projects I am working on. Easily purchased and a third thicker than 3/32".

Not nearly as interested in saddle compensation as the bridge dimensions and displacements. Compensation is part 2, after the bridge is made and installed.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 3:18 pm 
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Quote:
Not nearly as interested in saddle compensation as the bridge dimensions and displacements. Compensation is part 2, after the bridge is made and installed.


That's what the Teeter discussion addresses. His specific process is for installing a fully compensated bridge as an upgrade to a finished guitar.

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John

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 6:53 pm 
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Quote:
the bridge dimensions and displacements.


This is not a big deal --- Google 12 string bridge or go to your local music store and you'll see there are thousands of designs nothing critical but all placements fairly obvious. String spacing on a twelve is usually 2 3/16" offset the second row about .10, and back from the first row a logical, pleasing to the eye distance.

I agree with John -- the saddle compensation is the magic. I've retrofit several 12 strings with 1/4" fully compensated saddles and the results are delightful.

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ken cierp
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 7:09 pm 
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Ken, thanks. That's the sort of information I was looking for. And I'll plan on a wider saddle, taking your suggestion of a quarter-inch. Easy enough to cut the saddle slot one width as another. I could always buy a bridge from Martin to either copy or use, but I wanted to do as much of it as I could manage.

I originally posted my question on the forum after finding no joy in a Google search. Lots of intonation traffic, none about basic dimensions, that I could find.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 7:24 pm 
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Quote:
finding no joy in a Google search



No need to copy --- Take a deep breathe -- clear your mind -- -- put your ruler and calipers away -- forget everything you've heard about guitar design. Then ---

Google 12 string guitar images, there will 1000's, use your imagination and draw a bridge that you like and is pleasing to you. Surely you can estimate that the second row of pins is about 3/8" +/- behind the first and a twelve string bridge should be that much wider than a six string.

You will find "real joy" when your own creativity is the basis of your work.

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ken cierp
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:16 pm 
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That's advice I can like---Thanks!

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Peter Havriluk


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